Mana Games

[manutoo]

Hello,

we're studying the proposition to raise the Realistic Skill-average to 83% from 80% (ie: having 772 points left instead of 880).

The idea is to be able to put more points into drop shots, net skills and other secondary skills to get more varied rallies.

What do you think about that ?

Let us know !

Notes :
- this is not the majority winning, but a topic to gather your opinion to help us decide
- I can see who voted what, so don't try to skew the result

[Dani21]

I think 83% would be interesting. However the impact on official tournaments would be probably rather high. What i would suggest if it isn’t too much of a bother and if you can do it would be to have another “mode” added for a little while for testing purposes and host like a 500 or a 250 tournament on the mode. And if the tournament goes well and everyone is happy with it then we can delete said “testing” mode and make realistic mode 83% average. I’m saying this cause after all the tour was on 80% since forever so this change is pretty considerable imo and shouldn’t be done without actually seeing the consequences. Because in my mind if for example you implement it just before madrid or RG the impact on the competition may be too high unjustifiably especially for a big title.
I voted last option because for me at least until such testing occurs I cannot say if i want one or the other, practice sets isn’t a good comparison to actual competition.

[Jira]

Even tho my opinion is biased as I’m one of the people behind this change, I encourage you all to actually trust that this change will not be huge either, in the worst case scenario that worries most of the players that is “what happens if someone just maxes out rally and physical skills with those extra points?” The difference there is barely noticeable, your shots will be on average 2-3 km/h faster if you go from for example 94 to 100 power which is around 3% more power in game bc of the conversion, but it cost 12 points to do, whereas if you spend those extra points on net skills or drop shots, the difference will be a lot bigger because of how the first 60 points spend on a skill are way more noticeable and “optimal” making those same 12 points become an 8% increment on said skill in game if that skill was lower than 60 (and some skills cost 1 point for each 1% up until 100% like drop shot, lob or counter)
Taking what Dani said, I think it wouldn’t hurt to give the 772 mode a try in a specific tournament which is agreed beforehand like Rome for example, but I also believe (and again biased opinion) that the gameplay difference isn’t big if you only want to spend your extra points on baseline gameplay, and only becomes noticeable when you create a more “complete” player build (which is the main idea)
Everyone has their own opinion but know that because of how the math works, difference won’t be that noticeable if you only max out what you already have close to being maxed out that’s all I’m trying to say, remember that in game everything is held in the range of 30-90% in all skills from 0 to 100% you set up in your character screen

[Madferit]

I personally feel like the game already feels balanced with 880 as it's been since the game released in 2021. Dont quite get why it needs to change.
This argument that I see that "it doesn't change that much" is not very convincing to me, because why change it then? builds are already complicated enough even for expirienced players, and everyone is used to 880 points. Feels unnecessary to complicate it even further, and basically only to rebalance the game for one specific style of playing.
Furthermore it's possible it creates even more grey areas in gameplay, for instance with increased drop shot skills, just to name one, it could lead to some strange gamesmanship among the tour (the same way baseline lobs currently have to be limited).
Besides that I see that increased skill points, combined with ball mark + faster players, makes gameplay less balanced than wtsl gameplay for instance, where it gets compensated by players being slower, and where it is also harder to hit clean balls. Complete removal or preview/ball mark could be good if this changes end up happening.

[itsruze]

I haven't been playing online very long, but perhaps it would be interesting to raise the skill-average while changing control type to Elite rather than Simulation? I know Jira's wanted Elite controls in the past but was voted down. This might be a good opportunity to have higher-level skills in combination with more difficulty in shot making.

[squeakybum]

Was there a reason it was 80% in the first place throughout te history? And what about fair mode.

[Mystery]

I haven't been playing online very long, but perhaps it would be interesting to raise the skill-average while changing control type to Elite rather than Simulation? I know Jira's wanted Elite controls in the past but was voted down. This might be a good opportunity to have higher-level skills in combination with more difficulty in shot making.

One reason elite controls haven’t been used on tour is that TE4 was very error-prone when it first launched, possibly due to missing animations (i.e. we did not have sliding animations until maybe 2023) and glitches in the beta version, or simply it was harder. Manutoo also noted that simulation control on TE4 was roughly equivalent to elite control on TE3. As the game has developed over time, it’s now FAR easier to execute acceleration shots without missing, so revisiting elite controls could make sense.

That said, elite control tends to encourage more defensive, "pushy" play. This has been tested across players of different skill levels, and most people end up pushing because they’re trying to avoid errors, and the matches become an error fest. Again, we have tested this multiple times across the board. Still, if this is something folks are interested in, we can run a trial tournament (or even exhibitions).

[Franky Franchicha]

The real issue here is the 0-30 remapping. That's what allow to maximize stats because if you really hit a 0 dropshot, 0 lob or 0 volley you'd probably need to invest some points there

[Franky Franchicha]

One reason elite controls haven’t been used on tour is that TE4 was very error-prone when it first launched, possibly due to missing animations (i.e. we did not have sliding animations until maybe 2023) and glitches in the beta version, or simply it was harder. Manutoo also noted that simulation control on TE4 was roughly equivalent to elite control on TE3. As the game has developed over time, it’s now FAR easier to execute acceleration shots without missing, so revisiting elite controls could make sense.

That said, elite control tends to encourage more defensive, “pushy” play. This has been tested across players of different skill levels, and most people end up pushing because they’re trying to avoid errors, and the matches become an error fest. Again, we have tested this multiple times across the board. Not just me standing here stating out of the blue. Still, if this is something you’re interested in, we can run a trial for 2-3 tournaments (or even exhibitions) before deciding whether to move forward with it in main events.

That's a good idea. Best scenario is testing it in a competitive enviroment. Maybe a "weak" week with a 250 could be good for adding a second tournament in elite controls.

[Jira]

Well I didn't anticipate the Elite controls to become part of the conversation about the 772 points, but I'm 200% on it, as Ruze said, it would be a fair interchange for the extra points in my opinion, that's why we proposed it at the beginning of the year to begin with. We may test 772 in a tournament in the near future first (if manu could facilitate a test mode) and then we could also try elite controls in a specific tournament. Also having now 3 tiers of tournaments, elite controls would make sense to be a "main tour" only thing in my personal opinion

[itsruze]

One reason elite controls haven’t been used on tour is that TE4 was very error-prone when it first launched, possibly due to missing animations (i.e. we did not have sliding animations until maybe 2023) and glitches in the beta version, or simply it was harder. Manutoo also noted that simulation control on TE4 was roughly equivalent to elite control on TE3. As the game has developed over time, it’s now FAR easier to execute acceleration shots without missing, so revisiting elite controls could make sense.

That said, elite control tends to encourage more defensive, "pushy" play. This has been tested across players of different skill levels, and most people end up pushing because they’re trying to avoid errors, and the matches become an error fest. Again, we have tested this multiple times across the board. Still, if this is something folks are interested in, we can run a trial tournament (or even exhibitions).

I'll defer to the more experienced players here for their thoughts on the topic. Like I said, only been playing online for a short bit so I haven't played enough to have a strong opinion on any potential changes. I'm in favor of changes that raise the skill ceiling and allow for better skill expression though. Not saying the change to Elite would achieve this by any means.

[Jira]

Mod: XKT
Tournament: Beach House Exho
Category: Exhibition
Surface: Beach House
Start Date: April 25, 2026
Queue Until: April 24, 2026
This tournament will be played on free mode, no points earned for the winner since it's for testing only, and we'll give you guys the 772 points remapped builds to try the upcoming changes in a "competitive enviroment". If you want to use your own 772 points left build, send it to @Gifu through an screeshot on his DM and he'll give you the remapped version. It's imperative that you use the exact builds we facilitate you, there's no point in cheating (using more than 5 star talents, footwork boost, autopos on fast, maxing out stats,etc) because your opponent can check your whole stats on free mode while going to the menu ---> check player statistics, so really if you want to join this tournament be open to collaborate.

Register Here: OT_ViewTournament.php?Trn=2056

Follow up of this convo, we'll host a test tournament right after madrid first week. Come and try it out. It's an exhibition of course, no points will be played for but you'll stand as the Beach House Exhibition winner forever, that's good enough already!

[Rodri Fergo]

Increasing the available points with the same balancing as in Realistic mode sounds good to me.

Although TE4 is my first Tennis Elbow game and I've only played 278 hours and a little over 280 online matches (few of which are on the tour, as I'm still a novice in that regard), I have been able to try out different player builds with my Spanish friends, and I miss the variety that comes with having more points distributed across different skills. Right now, from my novice perspective, the tour meta seems pretty clear, albeit with some nuances. Adding variety to the game as proposed here seems interesting, as it would give players more options on the court.

That said, I'd bet that most players will apply those points to dropshots. 108 points distributed across volley values ​​seems insufficient to me, whereas with those points you could have a very high dropshot rating. The more experienced players can surely correct me on this, it may be that primarily increasing net presence points is enough to make net game more viable.

In any case, even if variety is added to the game, I feel it's very likely (just like with any other competitive multiplayer video game) that a meta will be established, and that supposed variety that's being pursued will be somewhat diluted.